Interface thermodynamics and driving forces

Exchange about the physics background, diffuse interface theory, etc..
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nlucas
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Interface thermodynamics and driving forces

Post by nlucas » Mon Aug 10, 2026 11:14 pm

Hi MICRESS team,

I'm modelling bainite sheaf growth in a simple Fe-C system using coupling with ThermoCalc. The simulations begin with finite radii (see images below). I have two questions relating to my outputs and the underlying phase-field approach. My driving file is attached for reference. You'll see that I have removed driving force averaging in the interface; I did this to compare interface equilibrium concentrations of carbon in austenite (c1pha1) with my calculated common-tangent amount from ThermoCalc, and compare maximum chemical driving forces with my calculated amount based on parallel tangent displacement at the bulk steel composition (294 J/cm3 at 0.4 wt% carbon). Since averaging is removed, these maximum driving forces are observed, in my simulations, at the outer edge of the interface, where carbon is the bulk amount (0.4 wt%). My two questions:

(1) Why are equilibrium carbon contents not always produced in the interface? I've found that this depends largely on C diffusivity in austenite and the capillarity (so interfacial energy and tip radius). I'm guessing this is due to the quasi-equilibrium constraint, which only imposes equal diffusion potentials and mass balance across the interface.

(2) Why does the chemical driving force as outputted depend on capillarity? The attached image shows two simulations that differ only in terms of initial ferrite radius (0.4 um and 0.2 um); the driving file is for the 0.2 um run. In the right panels, both the curvature and chemical driving force are higher (more blue cells). As a result, the smaller ferrite grows more quickly (since V = MG) and eventually propagates with a steady-state radius (see the other simulation snapshot). The larger ferrite slows to a stop before the steady-state tip forms; in this simple diffusional scenario, nothing should stop growth as long as there is austenite ahead of the tip with 0.4 wt% carbon.

Thanks in advance for your help :D ,
Nick
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nlucas
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Re: Interface thermodynamics and driving forces

Post by nlucas » Tue Aug 11, 2026 6:32 am

Correction: the delta G value of -270 J/cm3 labelled in the top-right panel of one of the images is the chemical driving force, not curvature. Apologies for that.
Clarification: in the two images, the left panels show the 0.4 um radius scenario and the right for 0.2 um. The simulation outputs in each of the two images are at the same time-step.

Nick

Bernd
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Re: Interface thermodynamics and driving forces

Post by Bernd » Tue Aug 11, 2026 4:49 pm

Dear Nick,

Welcome to the MICRESS forum. You are modelling a quite interesting and challenging system, and to make a successful simulation setup requires physical as wel as numerical assumptions.

Before discussing your specific model questions, I think, it is necessary first to address some numerical odds which cause numerical artifacts and thus cover the physical and model-inherent behaviour:

1.) You have specified global updates of the thermodynamic data (i.e. averaged for the whole domain). By specifying a much too large updating interval, you trigger an oscillating type of behaviour (because after the average interface moved by about its own thickness an automatic update is triggered). The solution is to use a much smaller updating interval (<1.E-4 s) to avoid such behaviour. Please also note that specifying the updating interval twice (in section "Database" as a global value for all interfaces and in section "Phase Interactions") makes no sense, because then it is done twice.

2.) If you activate "tablog" outputs you will get (among others) the .TabD tabular output of the diagonal diffusion coefficients. There you will see that your definition of the diffusion coefficient leads to a very small value for the fcc phase which is 6 orders of magnitude below that of the bcc phase. Perhaps this is just an error of units (cm/m). Apart from that, please note that you always should activate "tablog" outputs, because it gives you valuable information (e.g. the .TabL output file) without which you are "flying blind".

3.) As a general rule, in simulations with diffusion-limited growth, the diffusion pile-up should always be bigger or at least similar to the numerical interface thickness. Otherwise, artificial solute trapping creates wrong behaviour and a lot of problems. Depending on your choice of the diffusion coefficients in fcc, this may be not the case in your setup. For given diffusion data, the numerical interface thickness must be reduced accordingly. This can be achieved by increasing grid resolution and/or by reducing the numerical interface thickness. In your case, the numerical interface thickness is set to 8 cells which is extremely large. Please note that MICRESS is strongly optimized for a small interface thickness, so that it is sufficient to use 3-4 cells. Nevertheless, it probably will still be necessary to increase grid resolution as well.

4. ) I recommend to introduce the initial bcc-grain not by nucleation of a "large" seed (which is numerically very odd), but by setting it as a second grain within the initial microstructure. If you really want to set them by nucleation, the right way would be to nucleate it with an initial radius of 0 and to define a critical radius (by specifying "analytical_curvature") which is big enough to allow growth at the given conditions.

With these numerical adjustments, the behaviour of your system will completely altered, and maybe your questions will be answered (or modified...). However, a short answer to your questions is that under diffusion-limited steady-state growth conditions your local quasi-equilibrium only depends on curvature which has a strong effect on the local compositions (Gibbs-Thomson effect) and thus on the driving force.

Best wishes
Bernd

nlucas
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Re: Interface thermodynamics and driving forces

Post by nlucas » Wed Aug 12, 2026 7:49 am

Dear Bernd,

Thanks so much for your response. I am running further models to implement your suggestions. A few questions in the meantime. First, how does this oscillating behaviour manifest in the simulation and how significant is it? An updating interval of <1E-4 s feels very frequent for a simple Fe-C system and slows down the computation. Second, at 400 C the diffusivity of carbon is on the order of 1E-12 cm2/s and observed bainite tip velocities >1 um/s, which for diffusion-controlled growth result in sub-atomic diffusion length scales (presently ignoring the effects of elasticity). Is usage of atc and mob_corr corrections enough to capture diffusion-controlled growth where the grid resolution is larger than this unphysical diffusion length scale? I suppose this is not much different than the interface being mathematical as opposed to physical?

More questions to come... Thanks again.

Nick

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